Wired For Dating: A Summary of Stan Tatkin's Book
In this episode we discussed Stan Tatkin's book Wired For Dating and how that could help us in dating.
Transcript:
So the topic tonight is we're going to talk about STEM Takins award for dating. And so I can really talks about neuro biology and. Attachment theory, and so really, it's about. His work is really about, he says to when you're in a relationship, is 10 nervous systems interacting with each other, which is the reason why people can end up arguing over silly things, which is really what they're arguing about. So in the breakout rooms we were discussing.
What happened in your relationships or relationships that you think? And just before we we open up the discussion or just a couple of people say, just so everyone knows what's going on. So what we do here is we have a chat here in the main room. And the the chat here is recorded when you go into the room is private and then the recording you can catch. So if you've missed any time, you can listen in. What I'm looking for is an example of maybe and oftentimes we can't really explain why we get into these arguments.
But just looking for some real life examples so that we can we can use them to illustrate the principles and bring some clarity to them. Does anyone have anything that they were talking about in the. In the breakout rooms that. They could share. So if you want to I me to come you. Yes, I was talking with Sasha, so she left.
So she told the people I mean, in arguments in relationship, when the argument happens, the couple argues like a child is.
So the reason is because of lack of communication and I mean too much expectation.
So that's her answer. But my answer was that, I mean, since they love each other and they know each other so much, so they're connected to each other and they also called themselves like baby or things like that. So they're going to love each other. They act like a baby. Similarly, when they come correct, like when they are caught, they also act like baby.
And if they would have argued without relationship, I mean, they're not familiar with each other or maybe they are colleagues, they might not have like argued like childish childishly. And the other reason is that when they argue they know so much detail about themselves, like they used small details, like somebody says that your I mean, snoring is not good enough. I mean, your dress up is not good. And so this kind of small little things are used in arguments to hurt each other.
So this kind of small little things, when I brought in these kind of arguments, these are also components of babies like childish like arguments. So this is my I mean, thought about why they I mean, when they argue they act like childish. Well, they may not be childish. Well, I'm not saying it's not, but it might be that these things have annoyed them for a long time, like snoring, for example, but they just haven't mentioned it before because everything was fine and dandy and, you know, and there was no underlying problem.
So he didn't mention it. They just thought it. And then when something else is annoying them, then I'll bring it up. So it's actually just simmering under the surface.
So while they're arguing about the snoring, but it's not really about snoring.
Well, yeah. Yeah, probably not. No, they've brought it up. Yeah. So there's actually underlying issues on other issues.
You know, I think that's just a lack of being able to communicate around those things. So say like someone's got an issue with snoring or I think most of it is borne out of not expressing what you want clearly, and then not finding a sort of like mutual resolution to it looks like a win win situation or.
I think that's probably where it kind of yeah, and I think also because people aren't really clear on what they want. Only when they feel like they feel like I'm reading them what going on and just react. Yeah. But as you said before, it's sometimes a symptom of something that's an undercurrent. And so it's something that in good times you would probably tolerate, even though it is something that you wouldn't like. I have been through snoring and it drives me crazy because I wake up very irritable because I can't sleep.
And the response that I used to get is, what do you want me to do about it? So which says to me, you don't give you know a lot about me because you know that I need to sleep.
Therefore, that just escalates and escalates when if everything was lovey dovey and also very nice and stuff, you would try to find a way to de-escalate the tension. And, you know, what's that? What's happening. But because there is something else that is driving you bonkers or you're angry about that causes the explosion.
Well, for me, it causes me to just. I lash out with a pillow and a knife. No, I am I don't need any tools. I'm just very, very honest and very caustic. And so my husband will tell you, when you speak sharply, you cut like a knife. I'm sorry. It's nothing to boast about, but it's the truth. That's what he said.
Yeah, but not in that situation. His response basically meant he doesn't care. It's a lack of respect for you. Exactly. He's not doing anything about it. He's not trying to solve the problem.
So why does he feel like that? Because presumably, like five, 10 years earlier, he didn't. So why is he ended up like that?
I suppose it's a power play. It was a power play. Power play, OK? Did you have two bedrooms in the house, you could just or just left yourself maybe, I don't know, just no, no. He lives in Jamaica and I live in the UK.
And you can hear him when he when we are together in London.
But I believe that I mean I mean, living in two separate rooms will not solve the problem.
It will. I mean, make the problem deeper because you. I mean, living together, maybe they could I mean, make some kind of point. But if they're separate and they're lives, I mean, living in two separate, you can make the situation worse. There is quite a number of people that they sleep in separate bedrooms.
Yes, it depends on based on their preferences. But for me, I believe there may be whatever problems is happening. The problem is happening between these two people. So if they're working together, maybe try to find some common ground, then it will escalate the situation by living separately. Maybe that helped them come down at some point, but constantly living separately will make the situation worse.
This is not a start in the end, though, separate. But what I don't know is not necessarily because, like I, I know my girlfriend, we both sleep much better when we're on our own because it is hard, you know, like if you want to sleep early one week later and and just if you've been used to being on your own, you sleep better. So I don't know. But a lot of couples like if someone is snoring all the time and I can't change that.
My solutions, yeah, there are I don't know, but I do know that there was quite a sizeable number of people that do things separately. I suppose I think is unique, I think. I don't think that's necessarily. The end of a relationship or the start of the end of the relationship, it can just be a way then they they work out. As Colum pointed out, though, it's about the response that you get when you mention something to your partner.
It doesn't have to be about snow or it's whether they take it on board and even if they're not very active in terms of changing it. But at least they respond to you as though they're willing to do something about it to to reduce your impact that is happening on you. You know that. Yes. This is you're not happy about this and with good reason they will try to meet you halfway. It might not work because like, for example, snoring is very hard to resolve.
But if you're trying to make an effort. Then I would feel as though, OK, fine, you are trying to help the situation, but if you are not, then it says data for you.
Just as a show of hands, how many people and if you can resolve it, if the reactions down the volunteers, a show of hands, how many people have heard of attachment theory?
OK, and what was a question of it's such a mystery and does anyone know what attachment style they have that without just if you read it?
I think, Michael, I think I go through different attachments. I think sometimes I'm sure sometimes what's the other one, depending on what's the other one where you don't want? Well, for the fourth one's not very common, though, is it?
No, actually, I don't have the percentages and I. Yes. Is that the one are you talking about anchor and Wave and whatever? Yeah, although it's not secure, anxious, anxious, avoidant and ambivalent, fearful. I think I'm very avoidant sometimes, all the times I'm anxious and sometimes and completely secure, OK, depending on on.
Yeah, I mean we go through stages I think.
Yeah. How we feel like if you're with family, well, assuming it's a good family, then you're probably going to feel more secure than if you were in a situation you like your new workplace, you don't really know anyone. You're probably going to be the context is going to determine some of that. So roughly. OK, so we'll get into attachment actually a little bit. But first of all, I just want to give some background for anyone.
Oh, yeah. The other thing was how many people have read the book or listen to the TED talk. So one, two, three. To talk. Yes, there was a TED talk or attachment theory. Now it was where we stand. Stand by. Anyway, I'm going to I'm going to run through that. So I'm just going to meet everyone now. There's no background noise. And then. We'll discuss in a minute. OK, so really.
Being in a relationship can become frightening because suddenly. Your future and your autonomy is caught up with someone else's. And so it means that you've lost what is the feeling of loss that a sense of identity when you're single, you can just make a decision and can do whatever you want to do. And when you're in a couple, you then there's someone you have to check against. And especially if you're raising children, then. It's not just how you parent them mean, it's also how your spouse, partner's parents and often you might have different styles.
And so you have this sort of. You don't have that freedom, so. Really, when we're born, we're born into. Into a context, we're born into a family and this someone who's looking after us. And. That. That introduction to the world. Is what's going to slum everything you see of the world from there on? It doesn't mean that you're condemned to to to that style, but it means that's the style that you that you have.
And different parents obviously vary in how well they are. Able to look after you, how much space, how much stress they have, whether they have postnatal depression, whatever the context of their relationship or and how the living circumstances and all of those. Factors determine how you grow up. So this is so attachment theory really is based in your earliest experiences of the world. So when we're born, we're completely helpless and we're dependent on. Of caregiver, which is usually definitely when attachment theory came out, was mostly the mom, but whoever is mainly looking after the child.
So as a baby, we both completely helpless. We there's nothing that we can do for ourselves and we can't even ask. And so some parents are naturally maternal, paternal, and they'll respond and they'll be able to work out the latest nappy, change the food in comfort. And now so the only way that the baby can ask for help is by crying, so. What attachment theory is really about is how responsive that parent is, determines the trust that the baby has in that person and then that trust in that person shapes how they see the world.
So a person that has a secure, responsive, caring parent looking after it tends to trust other people more. So there's a story of six men and six women come across an 11. And one of them's got its trunk and one of its leg and one of them is a one of them's got its main body and one of them's going to tell and whatever other partners. So then you've got. Like six different people that have six entirely different interpretations of what an elephant is, and they describe it to each other and they they can't like, you know, your life because it's not like that.
So their experience, because they can't see the whole they've only just they can kind of feel around apar. They have different experiences in the same way. We all have different experiences in the way they grow up. And this is attachment theory in terms of how responsive main caregivers. But it's also about a culture. It's also about our family. It's about our religion. And all those factors shape how we first see the world and then everything that we see after that.
Is based on the initial initial view of the world. So. So we're going to look at numbers, about 50 percent of people are securely attached, 20 percent are anxiously attached. Twenty five percent are avoidant and five percent are fearful. And so. So what happens when someone has a really responsive, caring mum or dad? They then feel like they're going to trust them and then they're going to trust other people, so. So when I first did research on how they discovered this was they noticed that children were about to have free would some would really cry when they separated from their mom and some...
